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Is Hydrogen a viable option for our Automotive Future ?

Can hydrogen belong of our electrified vehicle future? This video was made as part of my Michelin video series and checks out how we could use hydrogen propulsion systems in lorries. I visit two companies leading the way in hydrogen technology, and .

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Video Contents
00:00 – Introduction
01:01 – Making Hydrogen
03:13 – and Super Caps!
08:00 – Motors and Carbon Tub
12:58 – Driving the Riversimple Raza
18:07 – Hydrogen Hypercar
19:28 – When EV does not work!
21:20 – Radical
22:55 – Fuel Cell Porsche Cayman
24:49 – How to use a Fuel Cell
28:58 – Driving the Fuel Cell Cayman!

#PetrolPed #Michelin #Hydrogen

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Comments

45 responses to “Is Hydrogen a viable option for our Automotive Future ?”

  1. @limitedmark Avatar
    @limitedmark

    I would like to share your vision, but hydrogen is just too energy intense to produce it green, you may as well use the energy that makes hydrogen, to make electricity and store it. We at a new revolution in transport and hydrogen has been stepped over.

    Reply
    1. @mrgrumpy771 Avatar
      @mrgrumpy771

      EV batteries are not green – slavery to mine Cobalt and the sources of Nickel constrain it.

      Reply
    2. @matthewoakley3772 Avatar
      @matthewoakley3772

      Hydrogen is just too energy intense to produce it green. Please explain. Hydrogen is easy to store, electricity is not.
      It can be created with electricity created by green methods in periods of glut.

      Reply
    3. @limitedmark Avatar
      @limitedmark

      @@matthewoakley3772 How are you making your electricity? Most hydrogen produced today comes from gas using high temperatures, and requires masses of energy and is not green. If it is made from water it requires masses of energy, not many countries are fully green electric on the scale required. Basic school science converting one energy to another is not efficient. If you think hydrogen is easy to store you need to look into it ,1kg of hydrogen requires 11m3 to store it at atmospheric pressure. To shrink it to make it smaller to store, requires even more energy. Hydrogen was a pipe dream. If you all ready have that energy in electricity it is just easier to use electricity.

      Reply
    4. @l10industries Avatar
      @l10industries

      @@matthewoakley3772 Hydrogen is TERRIBLE to store. It escapes out of literally everything as a gas. Anywhere that contains a hydrogen tank needs to be ventilated. To have better density, you have to liquefy hydrogen and that is a whole extra can of worms. You have to actively chill it or use it quickly. Liquid hydrogen tanks have to have a relief valve to release gaseous hydrogen to the atmosphere for when it warms up. So you use it or lose it. I can leave my BEV for literally months and watch a 1% loss of charge and that is mostly due to charging the 12v battery the connectivity runs off of. That being said, I do agree there are green ways to make it and it may not be bad to make during periods of extra energy. There are vehicular uses for hydrogen but they will probably be limited to medium to heavy duty vehicles if battery technology doesn’t eclipse fuel cells first.

      Reply
    5. @michalklucz6907 Avatar
      @michalklucz6907

      @@matthewoakley3772 “it can be created with green electricity” in the less efficient process that charging a vehicle with that green power.

      Reply
  2. @gordonmackenzie4512 Avatar
    @gordonmackenzie4512

    Hydrogen has been produced for many years in Orkney. Sea water is split using surplus wind and tidal energy. Hydrogen fuel cells are used to power the hospital and Harbour.

    Reply
    1. @kalebdaark100 Avatar
      @kalebdaark100

      A much better use for hydrogen tech. The gas is used pretty much used at source reducing leaks. For general transport needs it’s just silly.

      Reply
    2. @michalklucz6907 Avatar
      @michalklucz6907

      @@gordonmackenzie4512 this is a reasonable use. If you have abundance of energy, create as much hydrogen as possible. Store, and use later or elsewhere

      Reply
    3. @lurcher300b Avatar
      @lurcher300b

      Yes, but if that was built now, rather than “many years” ago, I suspect it would be a different solution storing the surplus wind and tidal energy in batteries and then directly powering the hospital and harbour (and whatever else you want if you have a local grid).

      Reply
    4. @michalklucz6907 Avatar
      @michalklucz6907

      @@lurcher300b it depends on how much and for how long they have to store. Storing electricity in batteries is EXTREMELY expensive and space ineffective. Yes you can have a powerbank for your house, but if we are talking about something like hospital the battery size would be enormous.
      More, in case of emergency, if you run out of battery, you are ‘done’ if you have generator run on hydrogen you can always transport and refill.
      Hybrogen is a dream material to deliver massive power to places where building high power installation is difficult/cost inefficient.
      but the entry point is the same. the electricity used to create hydrogen must be FREE, not green, FREE, like surplus from renewable sources or nuclear plants.

      Reply
  3. @gordonmackenzie4512 Avatar
    @gordonmackenzie4512

    Hydrogen fuel cell cars have been around for over a decade. Honda had the clarity. Toyota had the Mirai, which is now on generation 2. The problem was always the lack of fuelling stations to fill up with hydrogen. There is one in my small city, but it’s in the bus depot and used for their own buses.

    Reply
    1. @Lewis_Standing Avatar
      @Lewis_Standing

      Exactly 3 Mirai have been sold in the UK in the last 2 years.

      Reply
    2. @michalklucz6907 Avatar
      @michalklucz6907

      @@gordonmackenzie4512 also because the size of the tanks (“hydrogen is easy to store”) mirai is extremely compromised vehicle

      Reply
    3. @ziploc2000 Avatar
      @ziploc2000

      And hydrogen is very expensive compared to just plugging into the grid or your own solar panels. I’ve very comfortable not going to a gas station to buy gas or hydrogen.

      Reply
  4. @solentbum Avatar
    @solentbum

    A small problem with Hydogen power , at this time, is cost. I have been reading and hearing about Hydrogen power for the past 50 years, yes 50 years, the principle for using the gas is well known , but still the price point for clean Hydrogen is too high. It may be that the promised breakthrough in Fission electrcal generation will occur, (again I have been waiting for 50 years) but until we have very cheap eletricity to spare the future will still be BEV, or other electric power trains. Producing Hydrogen that is not pollution free in its process is a non starter.
    The world wide requirement is for non polluting vehicle power. be they BEV Trams , Trolley buses, pantograph lorries etc. Priced and available for the masses.
    Not once was the real world cost mentioned in this video, very interesting though is is.

    Reply
  5. @gmuzz Avatar
    @gmuzz

    Hydrogen and synthetic fuels are definitely part of the solution but they will be at the margins.

    The elephant in the room is the cost to produce the fuel.

    Large vehicles can use hydrogen and old classics can use synthetic but at a cost. Where they are needed they will excel.

    Reply
  6. @maz2044 Avatar
    @maz2044

    Guys we’re in 2025 this feels so tomorrows world from the 1970s…

    Reply
    1. @ziploc2000 Avatar
      @ziploc2000

      That was a great show but yes, hydrogen may be possible as a fuel, but that doesn’t make it efficient or desirable for the end user.

      Reply
  7. @michalklucz6907 Avatar
    @michalklucz6907

    Great video, sadly there is one flaw in this. I am sure they are all great engineers, but they still cant bend laws of physics. Unless we have abundance of electricity from nuclear plants, manufacturing of hydrogen is still not cost efficient!
    You have to pay more than for electricity,
    you have to visit a specialised station instead charging at home,
    you still support monopolies, because you cant produce hydrogen on your own.
    and after decades of work you still don’t have a single comfortable car that could match market expectations.
    Hydrogen sounds great for heavy duty machines/transports, because they need dedicated stations anyway, and have more space for tanks.
    can be used as fuel for electricity generators next to ev charging hub (if we can use free nuclear energy), but hydrogen passengers cars? Still cant see a purpose.

    Reply
  8. @charlesholder8009 Avatar
    @charlesholder8009

    I once suggested you would change from Petrol Ped to Electro Ped but how about Hydro Ped?

    Reply
    1. @MichaelWalding-q7o Avatar
      @MichaelWalding-q7o

      How about Pete the Delete!!! Iv’e noticed a deduction in a few of the 👍 totals . Phhhhh

      Reply
    2. @jonathanbain4616 Avatar
      @jonathanbain4616

      @@MichaelWalding-q7o He’s actually rubbing out!!!! 😂 Speaks volumes!

      Reply
    3. @PetrolPed Avatar
      @PetrolPed

      Not sure what you are in about 🤷‍♂️

      Reply
  9. @ianroper2812 Avatar
    @ianroper2812

    Hang on there are only 16 Hydrogen filling stations in this country. Come back in a few years and talk to us sensibly. I’ll be dead by then. River simple? Sums it up really….cos they are.

    Reply
    1. @PetrolPed Avatar
      @PetrolPed

      Maybe watch the whole film 🤷‍♂️

      Reply
  10. @martynb9 Avatar
    @martynb9

    I think you would have been better off doing a video on how the distribution is going to happen rather the vehicles but that wouldn’t have ticked the boxes for Michelin I guess. I think hydrogen does have a place for buses and construction but otherwise I think it’s going same way as the Betamax video 🤷‍♂️

    Reply
    1. @mbak7801 Avatar
      @mbak7801

      Oooh, bad example. Betamax produced a far superior picture (not as good as the Phillips 2000 though). VHS however had the huge library of porn available. With that the worst quality video (VHS is truly diabolically bad!!!) won.

      Reply
    2. @martynb9 Avatar
      @martynb9

      @ great example, that’s my point, it would be great if Hydrogen was part of the solution but like VHS Electric already has its foot in the door and rather than sorting the infrastructure they’re producing cars that no one can use

      Reply
  11. @martynb9 Avatar
    @martynb9

    Also the amount of energy it takes to create hydrogen you might as cut out the middle man and stick it in a car battery

    Reply
    1. @TheLastMoccasin Avatar
      @TheLastMoccasin

      But…. if you ARE the middle man selling fuels to be burnt for the past 100 years… then Hydrogen makes perfect sense… or 💸💰🤑

      Reply
  12. @jelloMohnny Avatar
    @jelloMohnny

    Just watch the Engineering Explained video from last year. Clearly proves, mathematically in fact, why this just doesn’t work for passenger vehicles. There’s a reason why the EV won out over hydrogen. These “paid” ads are getting a bit too frequent on this channel.

    Reply
  13. @fishtigua Avatar
    @fishtigua

    In the Marine Industry we too are looking at alternative fuels. Heavy Oils are mostly used at sea on big ships, that muck that belches out black smoke you can see from Space. Only when the ship comes close to the coast do they switch to light fuel-oil to look clean. All the EV cars on Planet Earth can’t cover the pollution 1000 ships on passage. This is why we are looking at Ammonia, a richly dense fuel full of Hydrogen. Basically similar power plants we use today can be remade as compatible.

    Reply
    1. @slloyd6577 Avatar
      @slloyd6577

      Commercial ammonia is made from fossil fuels isn’t it?

      Reply
    2. @fishtigua Avatar
      @fishtigua

      @@slloyd6577 the Haber-Bosch system used green energy and seawater.

      Reply
  14. @londonwestman1 Avatar
    @londonwestman1

    1:25 “About 50% of today’s hydrogen comes from natural gas…” Yes, and most of the rest comes from oil and coal. A little under 5% comes from renewable sources, and that isn’t going to grow because it’s far more economic to use the electricity via a battery or transport it via wires than convert it to hydrogen.

    95% of Hydrogen for transport discussion is greenwashing and it’s irresponsible not to say that.

    Unsubscribed.

    Reply
  15. @kalebdaark100 Avatar
    @kalebdaark100

    0:36 “…I think that the future of automotive propulsion systems is more than just battery electric.”
    er.. you mean like a hundred years ago when there were horses, steam powered and electric vehicles along side petrol vehicles? I suggest you learn some history and economics.
    Hydrogen used for road transport is a nonstarter for all the reasons already put in the comments by many others.

    Reply
  16. @bill_heywood Avatar
    @bill_heywood

    I had a look last night, there were 3 hydrogen fuelling points for cars available in the UK – London, Sheffield, Aberdeen. Anyone promoting hydrogen as a fuel for cars is either a fool, or a fossil shill. They almost never own a hydrogen powered car and if they do, they have more practical vehicles to actually use daily

    Reply
    1. @ziploc2000 Avatar
      @ziploc2000

      In the USA if you don’t live in Los Angeles or San Francisco you are SOL.

      Reply
  17. @tomcockcroft9394 Avatar
    @tomcockcroft9394

    Notice how they never mention the range

    Reply
  18. @peterwilliamson1825 Avatar
    @peterwilliamson1825

    Physics is the reason why hydrogen WILL never be a viable fuel for cars.

    Hydrogen is the second smallest atom known to man thus it is very hard to prevent leakage. It also needs to be stored at MINUS 253 degrees C and 10,152 psi (700 bar).

    As the owners of the Toyota Mirai have found out. The hydrogen filling nozzle can freeze in place when filling and Toyota’s official guidance says in the owners manual is to wait a few minutes after filling for the connection to thaw and it’ll release. They don’t tell you how to release that connection when the ambient temperature is near or below zero.

    They don’t store hydrogen at the filling stations at 700 bar but to get a worthwhile amount of hydrogen (range) in the car it’s compressed by the filling pump at delivery. This means that the pump needs to compress the liquid hydrogen for the next delivery after the first delivery has been dispensed. This is why we’ve seen long queues forming at hydrogen filling stations in California. They are waiting for the filling pump to recompress before they can fill the next car.

    Ultimately electric cars probably wouldn’t have caught on as well as they have if Tesla hadn’t created its own charging network. I can’t think of another car manufacturer that has done the same. Toyota certainly didn’t create a hydrogen filling network. Hence they have failed to get a decent foothold in California and Norway.

    (Whilst Nio have a network of battery swapped stations, few exist outside of China, hence why I don’t consider this a real network)

    Reply
  19. @slloyd6577 Avatar
    @slloyd6577

    The biggest challenge facing low emission hydrogen is that it is expensive to produce, expensive to transport, expensive to store, expensive to distribute, and expensive to use. Whether you’re switching existing users to clean hydrogen or pushing hydrogen into sectors where it’s not currently used, it takes money – and lots of it. (extract from the “Cleaning it up” podcast). Countries have spent wasted millions on hydrogen as a fuel.

    Reply
    1. @ziploc2000 Avatar
      @ziploc2000

      They want to replace dirty gasoline and diesel with “clean” hydrogen, but still tie me to buying it from a supplier at a location far from my home, when I can charge my electric car at home cheaper, and cut out the middleman.

      Reply
  20. @gohumberto Avatar
    @gohumberto

    Sooooo …let me get this straight. You take electricity that you could put straight into an Electric car and use it to create Hydrogen which goes into a Hydrogen fuel cell …. to create electricity??
    OR … You take electricity that you could put straight into an Electric car and use it to create Hydrogen which goes into a combustion engine ….. with thousands of complicated moving parts and a tank full of highly explosive gas under your seat at 5000psi. (Do people even even know what happens to a SCUBA tank in a car crash? It’s like a bomb going off).
    Am I missing something here? This doesn’t even start to address the distribution & delivery issues of Hydrogen. The whole thing seems so over-complex.

    Reply
    1. @PetrolPed Avatar
      @PetrolPed

      Soo…let me get this straight…you didn’t watch all the film 🙄

      Reply

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