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Nissan & Porsche’s Two-Port Charging Explained (NACS & J1772 At The Same Time?)

Bottom line, it's everything about cash. Cash and timing are the reason the NACS/J3400 port on the Nissan Leaf and upcoming Cayenne EV is DC-only, however the factor for the J1772 port on the other side? That may make more sense than you believe. I wish Nissan had offered us a complete AC/DC J3400 port on the guest side, but I also think that the AC-only J1772 needs to stay. Why? Due to the fact that J1772 FAR outnumbers Tesla location chargers in the wild …

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30 responses to “Nissan & Porsche’s Two-Port Charging Explained (NACS & J1772 At The Same Time?)”

  1. @rightlanehog3151 Avatar
    @rightlanehog3151

    Alex, Why not?

    Reply
    1. @nc3826 Avatar
      @nc3826

      cuz

      Reply
  2. @nvn2005 Avatar
    @nvn2005

    Nissan always leaves something out for desire

    Reply
    1. @RichardJoashTan Avatar
      @RichardJoashTan

      But I will buy the new nissan leaf anyway.

      Reply
    2. @nc3826 Avatar
      @nc3826

      At that price point. It shouldn’t be a major consideration…. IMHO

      And soon they’ll be the Bolt c’est la vie

      Reply
  3. @WilliamPozo Avatar
    @WilliamPozo

    Alex, the reality on the ground is that the tesla stations always work and are always available. You can talk about the old standard all you want, but most people want the NACs tesla connector b/c its easier to use, its more reliable and the old standard is super unreliable!

    Reply
    1. @EVBuyersGuide Avatar
      @EVBuyersGuide

      The standard isn’t what’s unreliable; it has partly been that network operators didn’t maintain their equipment as well, and the reality that different interpretations of the communication standard have caused issues between car and charger. As we see more non-Teslas charging, or trying to charge I should say, at Tesla stations, we will see more of this. Non-Tesla charging at a V3/V3+ station is not always smooth. We have frequently had to move test vehicles from one charging spot to another to get a charge session to start. (Remember, J3400 uses the exact same communications protocols as CCS) Also, as EA moves to J3400 connectors, EA won’t be any more reliable, they will just be EA with a J3400 connector that’s sometimes out of service.

      Reply
    2. @nc3826 Avatar
      @nc3826

      @@EVBuyersGuide WADR, when addressing the hardcore Tesla faithful, who Believe In the infallibility of Tesla’ and their stations that “always work”.. Any supposed counterpoint will just be perceived as attacks. on their belief structure..And is there for counterproductive. But if you ever convince one, please get back to me and I’ll eat my Proverbial hat, Since I would truly love to be proven wrong on this one. Just my two cents on it.

      But ironically I kind of agree with the Tesla fanatic it’s more elegant, so let’s just do it and get it done. Even if his logic is flawed.

      Reply
  4. @james2042 Avatar
    @james2042

    The more I see the nacs standard and learn about this connector the more I realize this connector was and still is a mistake to be the one to become the standard. I think we should have adopted a connector that is 3 phase capable like Europe, to allow commercial charging to be 3 phase instead. They still work on single phase at the low end so it doesn’t make sense why we would limit all our evs to single phase or DC. Then there’s the compatibility issues with 277v and adaptors, and there’s the fact Tesla already had to heavily redesign the connector to support 800-1000v charging, while the ccs standard natively supported 1600v charging. We’re stuck with it now, but all the automakers outside of Tesla should have really put their foot down and said no to that connector

    Reply
    1. @nc3826 Avatar
      @nc3826

      j3400 is compatible with three-phase service via 277v…. just need Onboard chargers to be retested for that voltage and if they don’t pass just swap in a higher rated onboard charger it’s simple and resolve the issue.

      “3 phase capable like Europe”? You mean CCS2? which is far less elegant than j3400…. And add zero value in the US market….with MCS for higher voltage applications. And switching to CCS2 would have even been more complex

      I’m fan of Tesla or Elon. But the facts are the facts…. USA is going to end up with something more elegant and more useful then what Europe has to offer…. Even if that triggers Europhiles who can’t accept that the US has something Superior…. C’est la vie

      Reply
  5. @nc3826 Avatar
    @nc3826

    Thx for the PSA, on the use of J3400 & J1772 ports, but there was quite a bit of faulty logic and rationalizations….

    OFC the onboard AC chargers is only tested and rated up to 240v, since that is all the J1772 port can handle. And the US grid voltage varies, so most devices are designed to handle higher voltages than they are rated for. But even if the AC onboard charger failed testing at 277 volts, swapping in an onboard charger that could handle it would have been pretty simple.

    Just requires adding the ability to switch between AC and DC, For the company’s too lazy and incompetent to do that, just stick with CCS1. Since what they did just adds complexity and confusion.

    Believe Leaf owners will be grudgingly accept the compromise. But I’m willing to bet there’s going to be some pushback from US Porsche Buyers… Since it’s such an inelegant way of doing it.

    FWIW Gemini AI agrees with me it says the adapters are smart, since they have a thermistor in it lol

    Keep up the good work I enjoy these Geeky takes on what’s taking place in the industry.

    Reply
  6. @VkXander1 Avatar
    @VkXander1

    What a mess. Could’ve just used CCS like the rest of the world

    Reply
    1. @tkmedia3866 Avatar
      @tkmedia3866

      But the rest of the world dont use ccs. If we were to use the most popular it would be GBT.

      Reply
    2. @nc3826 Avatar
      @nc3826

      Must be another Europhile…. As if CCS was one standard…. J3400 is just CCS with a more elegant connector. That Europe wished it had….

      So now we have four different ones… CCS1 CCS2 J3400 and MCS…. And Korea uses CCS1 too…. So pick your proverbial CCS poison.

      Reply
    3. @nc3826 Avatar
      @nc3826

      and GBT is just another CANbus variation like chademo

      Reply
    4. @EVBuyersGuide Avatar
      @EVBuyersGuide

      Europe doesn’t wish they had J3400 because it would mean much slower home charging. The reason they use the connector they do in Europe is because 3-phase power is required in some countries in order to charge over around 3.5 kW on AC and J3400 does not support 3-phase charging.

      Reply
    5. @nc3826 Avatar
      @nc3826

      @@EVBuyersGuide I know all that, (before it was mentioned in the post and repeat it in your comment)……. I just like to keep repeating how “much more elegant” J3400 is to all the triggered europhiles 😉

      But I would really prefer off-board AC charging like NIO offers but via J3400 instead… and then different off-board chargers could use three-phase or single phase or both… plus replacing or upgrading an offboard charger is more cost effective… Just a thought.

      Thanks for the feedback…. Hope you get a chance to give me feedback on my OC comment…. Have a nice day.

      Reply
  7. @EVRick-Ioniq5 Avatar
    @EVRick-Ioniq5

    I have both seen, and charged at, a 480 V three phase AC EVSE that was wired line-line for 208 V power. The one I used (early in 2017) was a 16 Volt unit which delivered 3.328 kW of power, much less than the 7.680 for which I had planned!

    Reply
    1. @nc3826 Avatar
      @nc3826

      And that we will have 277v as a faster option from 480 V three phase AC with true J3400 EVs… So is step in the right direction.

      Reply
    2. @nc3826 Avatar
      @nc3826

      Have fun reminiscing

      Reply
  8. @garyclark6747 Avatar
    @garyclark6747

    Elon gave a gift to himself as more Fast Charging Providers offer charging for the J3400 standard aka newer Tesla’s at no cost to him. As long as his Superchargers remain bi-lingual for the aging Tesla fleet that speak only CAN they will still be able to charge on his network. EA (limited- Orlando), ChargePoint Omni Port Deployments, EVGo (limited) and IONNA all currently charge all Tesla’s (even with an adapter if necessary) quicker than Superchargers due to charge handle thermal throttling on V3 & below Superchargers. Most non-Tesla EV’s charge quicker with those same non-Tesla providers 350kW or greater stations mostly due their ability to deliver charge current for instance a Equinox thirsts for or because the Voltage capabilities the Lucid, Porsche, Hyundai and KIA EV’s can advantage when designed to. The question I’ve always had is did Elon commit V4’s to be shared because they did not exist when these deals were struck? V2’s and Urban chargers never were part of the agreement which was always the reality that it wasn’t the “entire Tesla network” that they were given access to. It’s his network after all, he can do anything he wants. The J3400 network by others have to offer it to all. Welcome to his world crafted by his agreements. I suspected V4’s to be slow deploying because having a fire hose dispenser of energy can quickly over take equipment supplying the AC which means less plugs to keep the total load within the ability of the utility. These charges take time for the utility companies to provide for if plug counts are to remain high. 17:14

    Reply
    1. @nc3826 Avatar
      @nc3826

      “Elon??

      The only thing that really concerns him at this point at Tesla, is his pay package. Or firing people that question him. Since he still CAN…. No matter what EV signaling language Tesla uses….

      Good luck seeing the forest from the trees…. IE finding your way out of the forest.

      Reply
  9. @yessitsme6884 Avatar
    @yessitsme6884

    Two charge ports on the Leaf, one for AC one for DC? Why does this feel like déjà vu…

    Reply
    1. @nc3826 Avatar
      @nc3826

      It works for the biggest EV Market in the world

      Reply
  10. @subbiahpalani Avatar
    @subbiahpalani

    Wait till you see the crap Mercedes is gonna pull. Nissan did it better than MB

    Lowkey never thought I’d ever say that

    Reply
    1. @nc3826 Avatar
      @nc3826

      MB and BMW are the leaders…. Wish the US and Japan had had companies like that…

      And the crap that you’re alluding to was just over dramatized BS….

      Reply
  11. @FoamyDave Avatar
    @FoamyDave

    Excellent discussion as to the whys and wherefores of the charging connectors, protocols and the impact to EVs.

    Reply
  12. @davidws5439 Avatar
    @davidws5439

    The Nissan engineers should be fired, and Nissan fined for NOT following the NACS standards. If Nissan wanted a charge port on each side, that is great, but they should follow the standard for both DC and AC charging. That is so stupid I cannot believe a Japanese engineer and company would do something so stupid. The DC/AC charging is the main feature, along with the size, which is the best thing about NACS.

    Reply
  13. @davidws5439 Avatar
    @davidws5439

    NACS is used in Korean, too, and all of North America.😊

    Reply
  14. @COSolar6419 Avatar
    @COSolar6419

    I-80 across Wyoming is limited to V1or V2 Tesla chargers. Fortunately for nonTesla EV owners there are now a sufficient number of nonTesla DC fast chargers along that route.

    Reply

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